Login with username, password and session length

News:

Help chrisinajar pay for shit! Click here!

Author Topic: Balancing the heavy  (Read 2435 times)

  • Maggot
  • ******
  • Posts: 16
    • View Profile
Balancing the heavy
« on: September 01, 2009, 12:47:44 am »
I have played in your servers a bit, but this goes for most servers I play in, and I just wanted to say as my first post; that heavies are a little OP.  They do 600 damage and when they have a medic it's near impossible to kill them.  I main pyro and scout I simply have to avoid them because there is no way that I even have a chance to kill them (unless I get backburner crits, but that has poor hit detection).  Playing spy seems to be a lot of luck, and when you play against good heavies they look around as does their medic.

I know there is a guy on this forum that loves heavies or something, so I'm prepared for some flaming, but I strongly believe I'm right.  8)

  • The original Colon Three
  • CopyPasta
  • ****
  • Posts: 681
  • Entire team is babies.
    • View Profile
Re: Balancing the heavy
« Reply #1 on: September 01, 2009, 12:51:00 am »
XD Someone get Garret.

  • Banned
  • CopyPasta
  • ****
  • Posts: 618
  • eThug, PhD
    • View Profile
Re: Balancing the heavy
« Reply #2 on: September 01, 2009, 12:58:28 am »
Who would this heavy be?

I'll call myself a conspiracy theorist if you call yourself a coincidence theorist.

  • Maggot
  • ******
  • Posts: 16
    • View Profile
Re: Balancing the heavy
« Reply #3 on: September 01, 2009, 01:03:52 am »
You I believe, and your medic buddy was the first one to post I assume  >:(

  • Shen's Macro
  • ***
  • Posts: 470
    • AOL Instant Messenger - oriondoc357
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Balancing the heavy
« Reply #4 on: September 01, 2009, 01:09:30 am »
mangtang once you learn to circle strafe like a pro, heavies will no longer be a problem.

  • Obligatory Title
  • Shen's forum follower
  • **
  • Posts: 198
  • WHAT! 9000?!?!?
    • View Profile
Re: Balancing the heavy
« Reply #5 on: September 01, 2009, 01:11:34 am »
backburner

In terms of balancing priority, Valve has that weapon...

*takes off sunglasses*

... on the back burner.



YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH

  • Maggot
  • ******
  • Posts: 16
    • View Profile
Re: Balancing the heavy
« Reply #6 on: September 01, 2009, 01:14:19 am »
heavies can turn faster than you can circle them, l2p

  • Global Moderator
  • CopyPasta
  • ****
  • Posts: 628
  • This. Is. Æpik.
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Balancing the heavy
« Reply #7 on: September 01, 2009, 01:14:28 am »
mangtang once you learn to circle strafe like a pro, heavies with shitty tracking will no longer be a problem.
So true smitty, so true.

" Akuma = an asylum full of janitors. Retarded sweeps." -Jeed

  • Obligatory Title
  • Shen's forum follower
  • **
  • Posts: 198
  • WHAT! 9000?!?!?
    • View Profile
Re: Balancing the heavy
« Reply #8 on: September 01, 2009, 01:15:37 am »
heavies can turn faster than you can circle them, l2p

The minigun caps sensitivity when it's spun up.  Circlestrafing is really, really easy.  Just ask Fullbleed, it's one of the main reasons the heavy is underpowered.

  • Shen's Macro
  • ***
  • Posts: 470
    • AOL Instant Messenger - oriondoc357
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Balancing the heavy
« Reply #9 on: September 01, 2009, 01:30:39 am »
heavies can turn faster than you can circle them, l2p

Clearly you haven't seen me circle strafe.  In three directions at once.

  • Maggot
  • ******
  • Posts: 16
    • View Profile
Re: Balancing the heavy
« Reply #10 on: September 01, 2009, 01:34:45 am »
sasuke I assume you are just trying to troll my thread, so just leave please.

  • Shen's Macro
  • ***
  • Posts: 470
    • AOL Instant Messenger - oriondoc357
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Balancing the heavy
« Reply #11 on: September 01, 2009, 01:38:24 am »
Ole' Jeed is an expert at tf2 mang, you should be glad he's offering insight.

/not kidding


  • Bestest Buddy
  • Shen's Macro
  • ***
  • Posts: 308
  • In the Bestest Buddies Club
    • MSN Messenger - mitchell649@hotmail.com
    • View Profile
    • Hey Mitch
    • Email
Re: Balancing the heavy
« Reply #12 on: September 01, 2009, 01:56:29 am »
sasuke I assume you are just trying to troll my thread, so just leave please.

NO U!

Anyways, this whole forum is a series of friends trolling friends.

On topic, first of all, if you meet a heavy that knows what they are doing and you're a pyro, you will most likely lose.
Second of all, backburner, really? You're missing out on the refined crack that is the airblast.

I have played in your servers a bit, but this goes for most servers I play in, and I just wanted to say as my first post; that heavies are a little OP.

I'm sure there are a lot of other people that would argue otherwise.

  They do 600 damage and when they have a medic it's near impossible to kill them.

I see you met Virally. By the way protip: Virally + medic = run the hell away, especially when using the backburner.

I main pyro and scout I simply have to avoid them because there is no way that I even have a chance to kill them (unless I get backburner crits, but that has poor hit detection).

So they're op'd because they're good players?
Playing spy seems to be a lot of luck, and when you play against good heavies they look around as does their medic.

How dare people look around for spies, this is blasphemy.

I know there is a guy on this forum that loves heavies or something, so I'm prepared for some flaming, but I strongly believe I'm right.  8)

Flaming? Nah, we're all civilized around here :D

  • Obligatory Title
  • Shen's forum follower
  • **
  • Posts: 198
  • WHAT! 9000?!?!?
    • View Profile
Re: Balancing the heavy
« Reply #13 on: September 01, 2009, 02:08:25 am »
The truth is, anything with a medic is hard to kill when you're alone.  That's why this is Team Fortress 2.  After playing in some matches I can definitely say that pub servers do not represent the most pure form of the game.

  • Banned
  • CopyPasta
  • ****
  • Posts: 618
  • eThug, PhD
    • View Profile
Re: Balancing the heavy
« Reply #14 on: September 01, 2009, 02:12:39 am »
Well, I'll actually address his claims instead of stirring up suspense now.

The minigun takes about a second to actually fire, and even during the spooling, the heavy can only move at 27% speed. It's a hitscan weapon, so even though technically you can get hit instantly at any range, unless you're within a few character models of the heavy shooting you, it's not going to deal lethal damage. At long ranges, a bullet is more likely to miss than hit because of the random distribution in the large firing cone. Whenever the heavy isn't leveraging his minigun, he can move at 77% speed. His only mobile damage is the shotgun, which 3 other classes have, and his fists, which is entirely unreliable because of the heavy's movement speed.

His massive hitbox makes him very easy to hit, and that compounded by his poor mobility, gives him the worst survivability in the game. The reason you see me with a medic 99% of the time is because going solo as heavy is suicide. He's simply too large and too slow. Now consider how easy it is to damage a heavy because of his speed and hitbox, on top of the fact that he has very bad range.

The obvious solution is to quit charging heavies like a dumbass. Don't expect to walk up to an overhealed heavy and live. Just keep your distance and stay out of the open. He's not going to be able to quickly change position or move in and out of cover like you can.

TLDR: The heavy is probably the second- or third-worst class in the game. You're just getting out-played.


I'll call myself a conspiracy theorist if you call yourself a coincidence theorist.

  • Shen's Macro
  • ***
  • Posts: 355
  • A tribute to Chris' old signature
    • View Profile
Re: Balancing the heavy
« Reply #15 on: September 01, 2009, 02:23:17 am »
since both the heavy and the pyro are good at short range, but horrible after that, and since a heavy is almost always with a medic, heavies will just kill pyros. Simple as that.

Other classes can give the heavy problems, but a medic usually heals faster than a soldier can deal damage.

A soldier versus a heavy medic is a terrible fight, since both will want to run away.
I think I can make it.
Spy
Pyro
Awesome, looks like we'll be seeing you in the scrim ~2 1/2 weeks ago Spy Crab. :D

  • Maggot
  • ******
  • Posts: 16
    • View Profile
Re: Balancing the heavy
« Reply #16 on: September 01, 2009, 02:27:53 am »
But they heavy takes almost no skill at all, you need situational awareness only, which every class needs, aiming is hardly a factor considering the firing cone is so damned big, yet it still does a ton of damage.  Pyro, yes does not need very much aiming at all either, but the scout still gets owned by a heavy, and the scout takes  a ton of aiming to be effective.

Furthermore the heavy with 450 health and a 15 health per second with a medic, destroys pubs more than soldiers or demos with medics, simply because you become a tank with health regen.

Cornering heavies is only effective if they aren't getting actively healed, which is rare.

You complain about the movement speed, but it is rather negligible given that when you get into a fight and rev up, you have won, and getting to mid as a heavy isn't that bad either.

I just find it funny that medic and heavy, two classes with such low skill ceilings are so god damned effective compared to other low ceiling classes (engineer pyro)
« Last Edit: September 01, 2009, 02:31:27 am by MangTang »

  • Banned
  • CopyPasta
  • ****
  • Posts: 618
  • eThug, PhD
    • View Profile
Re: Balancing the heavy
« Reply #17 on: September 01, 2009, 02:30:25 am »
But they heavy takes almost no skill at all, you need situational awareness, aiming is hardly a factor considering the firing cone is so damned big, yet it still does a ton of damage.  Pyro, yes does not need very much aiming at all either, but the scout still gets owned by a heavy, and the scout takes  a ton of aiming to be effective.

Furthermore the heavy with 450 health and a 15 health per second with a medic, destroys pubs more than soldiers or demos with medics, simply because you become a tank with health regen.

Cornering heavies is only effective if they aren't getting actively healed, which is rare.

You complain about the movement speed, but it is rather negligible given that when you get into a fight and rev up, you have won, and getting to mid as a heavy isn't that bad either.

I just find it funny that medic and heavy, two classes with such low skill ceilings are so god damned effective compared to other low ceiling classes (engineer pyro)
Alright dude, if heavy's so easy to play then why don't you try stomping my server out with a medic?

P.S. Heavy+medic is 2 classes. Pyro or scout is just one. Do you really think you should be beating heavy+medics solo dude?

I'll call myself a conspiracy theorist if you call yourself a coincidence theorist.

  • Maggot
  • ******
  • Posts: 16
    • View Profile
Re: Balancing the heavy
« Reply #18 on: September 01, 2009, 02:33:30 am »
stomping your server out?

I'm just saying the heavy is imbalanced, not that you are a bad player.

  • Banned
  • CopyPasta
  • ****
  • Posts: 618
  • eThug, PhD
    • View Profile
Re: Balancing the heavy
« Reply #19 on: September 01, 2009, 02:37:13 am »
I'm just saying the heavy is imbalanced, not that you are a bad player.
You're right, he's actually quite underpowered. The reason you think he's overpowered is because you're bad.

stomping your server out?
Go heavy and find a medic, then try to pull off the same shit I do. I can probably take you by myself as soldier.

Also, protip for future reference: kill the medic first. He does NOT have 450 health.
« Last Edit: September 01, 2009, 02:38:57 am by Virally Yours »

I'll call myself a conspiracy theorist if you call yourself a coincidence theorist.

  • Baby Maggot
  • *****
  • Posts: 14
  • Moral High Ground
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Balancing the heavy
« Reply #20 on: September 01, 2009, 04:08:13 am »
I think OP is missing the big picture here. How can a Heavy use his mini gun with his hands then PULL OUT his boxing gloves? You would think the Heavy if using the KGB would need to be wearing them at all time, even when using his mini gun. Personally, I believe the concept of The Sanvich is quite plausible due to the Heavy having several pockets in which he could easily store his Sanvich, but the gloves are just over-sized and would NEVER fit in his pockets. Seriously, I mean the idea of the Heavy switching to his boxing gloves in little to no time at all is just preposterous...I mean, the Heavy is known to be slow, correct? So how could he put on his boxing mitts in the blink of an eye? Truly outrageous.

  • Maggot
  • ******
  • Posts: 16
    • View Profile
Re: Balancing the heavy
« Reply #21 on: September 01, 2009, 04:37:51 am »
you're too late bro

  • Banned
  • CopyPasta
  • ****
  • Posts: 618
  • eThug, PhD
    • View Profile
Re: Balancing the heavy
« Reply #22 on: September 01, 2009, 04:58:55 am »

I'll call myself a conspiracy theorist if you call yourself a coincidence theorist.

  • Double Deygit
  • Shen's Macro
  • ***
  • Posts: 276
  • NIOPE
    • View Profile
Re: Balancing the heavy
« Reply #23 on: September 01, 2009, 05:12:38 am »
YOU'RE TO SLOW! ;P

Holy headbonking humans hosting hostile horses who harass honorable heckling headfigures

  • Obligatory Title
  • Shen's forum follower
  • **
  • Posts: 198
  • WHAT! 9000?!?!?
    • View Profile
Re: Balancing the heavy
« Reply #24 on: September 01, 2009, 07:28:13 am »
Too zetta slow!